View Full Version : Once and for all, your least fave full length album
ScottyBHP
Oct-23-10, 3:30 PM
I've seen a smattering of opinions on this topic here and there over the years. I'm curious as to what say you.
davespear
Oct-23-10, 5:52 PM
I had a long think over this, and even though I'm an uber fan, and like 99.9% of CT, then I'd have to say HOH
The first three tracks are quite monumental, and then you get 7 lesser ones, weird I feel, but it's just mho
Moya xx
Oct-24-10, 6:06 AM
Noooooooo! I can't believe anyone voted for HoH!!!?!?!!
As for me, it's 4CC :(
Dpressed
Oct-24-10, 8:58 AM
I'm with Moya ... 4CC .. Victorialand was the biggest shock when I first heard it ... but it did grow on me ... IMHO 4CC just sounds like a band going through the motions
randomrob
Oct-24-10, 9:47 AM
Victorialand at least possesses some melodic beauty to it. I don't get that anyone can sit through Garlands. It's straight-up fugly.
fornasetti
Oct-24-10, 10:38 AM
I'm with Moya ... 4CC .. Victorialand was the biggest shock when I first heard it ... but it did grow on me ... IMHO 4CC just sounds like a band going through the motions
Bang on, Red. I listened to 4CC again a few nights ago, because sometimes I need to re-check whether my total dismissal of it is somehow wrong. It never is. :pee:
Fritter
Oct-24-10, 1:19 PM
Milk And Kisses does have it moments, like Violane and er...that's it. Sorry.
ScottyBHP
Oct-24-10, 5:48 PM
Victorialand at least possesses some melodic beauty to it. I don't get that anyone can sit through Garlands. It's straight-up fugly.
Oh, I soooo beg to differ about Garlands! If I understand correctly what ''fugly'' means I'd say it's feautiful!
As for Victorialand I never expected it to get any votes in this catagory whatsoever. I'm straight-up symied over that. But we all like differant things.
:2cents:
davespear
Oct-24-10, 5:53 PM
is fugly short for effin' ugly?
anyway, this sort of thing just goes to show that we're not all sheep, and that our tastes differ--good thing too, just keep enjoying the music:nod:
Damn - with so many damn polls I hit Garlands on here thinking it was the '1st album I bought' poll - any way I can cancel my vote for Garlands to I can vote for M&K as the worst CT album ??
davespear
Oct-24-10, 6:06 PM
it's weird for me that I adore BBK and Garlands cos they're pretty much polar opposites doncha think?
Dpressed
Oct-24-10, 6:09 PM
^^^^^
Yes DS .. they are the most extreme CT albums
Damn - with so many damn polls I hit Garlands on here thinking it was the '1st album I bought' poll - any way I can cancel my vote for Garlands to I can vote for M&K as the worst CT album ??
I'll investigate. I know I can change the totals, but as this one records who voted for what I'm not sure if I can fix that.
ScottyBHP
Oct-24-10, 6:15 PM
Must....hold...tongue....about.....BBK! I kinnet dewitt cap'n!!!! I'm showing all the restaint I kin must'r!!! She's gonna blow soon!!!! hehe :explode:
ScottyBHP
Oct-25-10, 8:40 PM
Oh, I soooo beg to differ about Garlands! If I understand correctly what ''fugly'' means I'd say it's feautiful!
As for Victorialand I never expected it to get any votes in this catagory whatsoever. I'm straight-up symied over that. But we all like differant things.
:2cents:
:longpost:
Ok, I'd like to follow up on what I said here about Garlands. Hmmm...how to put this....
Garlands takes some time, it's definately not an immediately listener friendly album. But I find it a very necessary first step in the band's trajectory. Robin would never have become the kind if guitarist that he is without first cutting his teeth on melodic dissonance. It was actually fairly common in this era to see bands start off their careers with more difficult and dissonant albums. After all it was the point in time in which punk was becoming post-punk which was becoming new wave. (A genre which I definately do not hang around the Twins' neck! Let me make that perrrrrrfectly clear.)
For example, I'm pretty sure that there are also those out there who like Pschedelic Furs who don't like their first album. An album which I consider to be the only truly classic Pschedelic Furs album and quite possibly one of the most underrated post-punk albums of it's time. (Shunned because it was released on a major label.)
The point is that "Garlands" and "The Pschedelic Furs" are both seminal albums in their respective genres. In the case of Garlands no CT album thereafter would have been the same without it. This is a good thing! And I dig it, every second of it!
:2cents:
randomrob
Oct-26-10, 10:59 AM
I'd just call it a shrieking plate of hot mess.
It got them on the map, which is good, but it's such a product of it's time. I liked (LIKED) it out of obligation when I was a young fan, but I can't seriously listen to it or HOH at this point. For me, CT crystallized on Aikea-Guinea. That's when Liz, Simon and Robin seemed to finally get in sync, and play to eachother's strengths, and created a music I'd never heard before or since.
Just realized this was least fave album as opposed to the other thread. I voted Treasure on both. Just a little conflicted apparently.
fredofla
Oct-26-10, 11:54 AM
I'd just call it a shrieking plate of hot mess.
It got them on the map, which is good, but it's such a product of it's time. I liked (LIKED) it out of obligation when I was a young fan, but I can't seriously listen to it or HOH at this point. For me, CT crystallized on Aikea-Guinea. That's when Liz, Simon and Robin seemed to finally get in sync, and play to each other's strengths, and created a music I'd never heard before or since.
complete agreement....
especially the observation about Aikea-Guinea (it was as if they finally realized they didn't HAVE to be "just another" fucked up goth band.)
Ghosty
Oct-26-10, 12:07 PM
It took me a long time but I really like Garlands now. I think it was the remaster that changed my mind. whereas before it sounded somewhat flat and dull it now has some depth and substance to it. Also I stopped comparing it to their later output and just took it for what it is: a piece of music from 1982. I like Heggie's basswork and the repetetive guitar patterns. Liz voice and the simple rhythmbox not so much.
But Grail Overfloweth is a mesmeric masterpiece by any standard. Crank that one up loud with lots of bass and get lost in the crystaline hypnotic maze.
I never understood FCC except for Pur.
I always understood Garlands.
ScottyBHP
Nov-13-10, 4:32 PM
Wow! Garlands takes an early lead! No surprise. Followed closely by the much maligned 4CC. I can see that my next task here is gwine be discussing the merits of 4CC!
Garlands pretty much takes care of itself. Those who prefer their Cocteau Twins melodic will never like Garlands anyway. :coffee:
He who doesn't like Garlands missed something or is younger than 40. The title track is even covered by The Autumns which appeared on the Goth tribute on Cocteau Twins CD, the best cover ever made on a song of CT in my opinion.
Garlands is dark and not a fine example of their later works. But it started all here. Without Garlands no Pink Opague or whatever.
wIceKMexxu4
randomrob
Nov-14-10, 9:09 PM
Garlands sounds like youth. I'm not missing it. lol
This one was really hard, because I like all of them. But I ended up voting for 4CC. Initially the lyrics struck me as sounding like something out of a self-help book. It took me a long time to get to where I could like it, and I do like it, but not as much as the other ones. But Garlands got the top number of votes, and that's my favorite... wow. I knew when I saw the low number of votes for it in the favorite threads that it was less liked than I'd have imagined, but I had no idea it'd be people's least favorite.
davespear
Feb-27-11, 3:14 PM
Wow! Garlands takes an early lead! No surprise. Followed closely by the much maligned 4CC. I can see that my next task here is gwine be discussing the merits of 4CC!
Garlands pretty much takes care of itself. Those who prefer their Cocteau Twins melodic will never like Garlands anyway. :coffee:
woah, what tosh! I adore BBK for its melodic layered sounds, AND I love half of Garlands. 'Blood Bitch', 'Wax and Wane', 'Shallow then Halo' are stand outs for me, different from their later stuff, and unmistakably 'early and youthful' but so what! I hope I'll listen to and appreciate current music when I'm a pensioner
I can't believe so many people don't like Garlands...it's my favourite album :crying:It inspired so many bands...so many genres....
I voted for FCC because I seemed to have put crosses through a few of the songs...
:lala:
4CC was their first album I heard and it was so different and
melodic to anything I'd heard previously. I was hooked on it then
and I still like it as much as other CT albums.
Garlands sounds like youth. I'm not missing it. lol
I've been listening to all the albums recently and was wondering what I think about Garlands and you hit the nail on the head there. I put it on, enjoyed Blood Bitch, But I'm Not but then skipped to Grail Overfloweth and that's all I need right now.
It's an eternal crying shame the engineer wouldn't let them make the drums sound like they wanted.
Dpressed
Mar-9-11, 3:11 PM
It's an eternal crying shame the engineer wouldn't let them make the drums sound like they wanted.
I know I'm being thick .. but can I ask for for info on this please
I love Garlands, but not all the time. I have to be in the right mood.
I know I'm being thick .. but can I ask for for info on this please
I think I read somewhere that originally they wanted to distort the drumsound to a degree...would have been interesting I guess...more fitting with the music than those clean drums you hear now.
randomrob
Mar-10-11, 9:28 AM
truly.
The programming and effects work they did later really gave the drums a (proper & well executed!) supporting role. On Garlands, the drum machine is so out front it waters down the music.
Any record with Blind Dumb Deaf on it should never be the worst anything. For me the worst would go to Milk and Kisses. It has a few beautiful songs on it, but out of all their records it also has the most clunkers. Tishbite? blehhh.... But I still drag it out now and then just because even the worst CT is usually still pretty good. What can I say? I drank the kool-aid when I was 16.
spangled
Mar-11-11, 10:24 PM
I love Tishbite. :blush:
Got my A machines on the table
got my B machines in the drawer
ceccobuff
May-27-11, 3:45 PM
For me it's Head Over Heels, which always upsets me because it sports what has to be my favorite CT album cover (so beautiful), but the music itself never keeps me interested. Theres no real spark for me (except Sugar Hiccup, barely) and they all sound really bored. I love and appreciate where it took them (musically), but I rarely listen to it, and when I do always I'm bored by it...
mike_mhg
May-28-11, 5:53 AM
My least favourite has changed constantly over the years. Fistly - and for a long time - it was HoH. Then gradually I began to get it, and now - with the exception of the awful Glass Candle Grenades - I totally enjoy it. Then it was Victorialand and then it was 4CC.
But I have a problem with not liking anything CT. So I play the least favourite to death to try and make it fit. I now realise 4CC has some fabulous Liz moments and so it is now back up the list.
Least favourite at the moment is Victorialand. But I still love it.
duluthee
May-28-11, 9:42 PM
Blue Bell Knoll to me. A few great songs in there, but I don't dig the overall vibe of the record. It sounds overproduced and rudimentary at the same time, like a first draft of HOLV only with less finesse. The drum sound is by far the worst of any Cocteau album, too muddy and thin, and I don't like the keyboard arrangements either. Also, I'm not so keen about Liz's vocals in half of the record, Simon's bass sounds fucken trebly and it's totally buried in the mix, and so on.
But then again, I rarely listen to M&K so in the end I don't know.
elysium
May-29-11, 12:29 AM
Garlands. Never thought it was listenable and still don't.
I think I read somewhere that originally they wanted to distort the drumsound to a degree...would have been interesting I guess...more fitting with the music than those clean drums you hear now.
Little late here, but as I recall, they had developed a certain sound in their live gig but may have involved some cheaper/lower quality machinery, they were talked into using something the producers thought more fitting, and whatever the specifics, they ended up losing something they'd built up(perhaps more naturally) in their live show replacing it with something more sterile.
davespear
May-30-11, 8:26 AM
Garlands. Never thought it was listenable and still don't.
Blue Bell Knoll to me. A few great songs in there, but I don't dig the overall vibe of the record. It sounds overproduced and rudimentary at the same time, like a first draft of HOLV only with less finesse. The drum sound is by far the worst of any Cocteau album, too muddy and thin, and I don't like the keyboard arrangements either. Also, I'm not so keen about Liz's vocals in half of the record, Simon's bass sounds fucken trebly and it's totally buried in the mix, and so on.
But then again, I rarely listen to M&K so in the end I don't know.
I am shocked! But each to their own
Bettina
May-30-11, 9:42 AM
Four Calendar Cafe.
Occasionally I put it on to check if I was wrong about it. I can't sit through Evangeline; life is too short.
It's not just the therapy-speak that puts me off. I prefer the range of singing on earlier records, especially the yelpy/shouty stuff.
But then HoH is one of my faves - there's no accounting for taste.
Dpressed
May-30-11, 10:51 AM
^^^^^^
I agree with Bettina
agcu418
May-30-11, 2:09 PM
I agree
FCC.
It's twee. And the sudden comprehensibility of the lyrics didn't do LF any favours - reads like the poems my life writing class produces.
randomrob
Jun-6-11, 4:39 PM
testing
Maybe we could organize the different kinds of CT fan according to which album they claim not to like ...?
I can definitely see two kinds, the Garlands-hater and the 4CC-hater. I am neither of them.
MirrorImage
Nov-10-11, 10:30 PM
It's Garlands for me. I mean it's not a "terrible" album, but I just didn't connect with it at all. This was the first CT album I heard, but I'm glad I had sense enough to continue to explore their output because when I heard Head Over Heels I loved it instantly and thought what in the world happened on Garlands? Anyway, Victorialand was the album that made me a CT fan while Blue Bell Knoll made me a devout fan.
Dpressed
Nov-11-11, 9:27 AM
^^^^^
Can I ask you to repost once you've heard Four Calendar Cafe and Milk & Kisses, please.
MirrorImage
Nov-11-11, 11:44 AM
^^^^^
Can I ask you to repost once you've heard Four Calendar Cafe and Milk & Kisses, please.
Absolutely, it looks like both of those albums are quite popular on this forum. Last night, I ordered my last missing link in CT's discography: the two 2-CD sets Lullabies to Violaine: Singles & Extended Plays Vols. 1 & 2. Can't wait to hear these as they collect their EPs or so I read.
andylama
Nov-11-11, 12:19 PM
Absolutely, it looks like both of those albums are quite popular on this forum. Last night, I ordered my last missing link in CT's discography: the two 2-CD sets Lullabies to Violaine: Singles & Extended Plays Vols. 1 & 2. Can't wait to hear these as they collect their EPs or so I read.
oops, nevermind what I just posted in your welcome thread. You're a step ahead of me.
...and I think you're going to LOVE Sigh's Smell of Farewell. Pure magic.
andylama
Nov-11-11, 12:20 PM
^^^^^
Can I ask you to repost once you've heard Four Calendar Cafe and Milk & Kisses, please.
Hahahaha!
MirrorImage
Nov-11-11, 12:38 PM
oops, nevermind what I just posted in your welcome thread. You're a step ahead of me.
...and I think you're going to LOVE Sigh's Smell of Farewell. Pure magic.
Excellent. I can't wait to hear that song. :)
Dpressed
Nov-11-11, 1:11 PM
I'm sure you'll enjoy L2V. I'll be interested to hear your opinion of Snow on L2V vol II.
MirrorImage
Nov-11-11, 10:44 PM
I'm sure you'll enjoy L2V. I'll be interested to hear your opinion of Snow on L2V vol II.
Snow sounds like a beautiful song already. I'll let you know my thoughts once I've heard it.
MirrorImage
Nov-12-11, 12:21 AM
Garlands. Never thought it was listenable and still don't.
I don't think it's not that it's unlistenable, but rather that it's too harsh and so different from the rest of their output. As I have said, if Garlands was the only CT album I heard, I wouldn't be a fan of their music.
davespear
Nov-12-11, 5:09 AM
people knock Snow and say it's a novelty record, which it is, but for me, it's such a happy sound, typically Cocteau, and absolutely delightful at Christmas, or indeed any time of the year
Dpressed
Nov-12-11, 12:23 PM
Snow sounds like a beautiful song already. I'll let you know my thoughts once I've heard it.
Errrr ... Snow is the title of the E.P. .. lets say the tracks on it aren't the usual CT fare :giggle:
davespear
Nov-12-11, 4:07 PM
snow schmo, lets just say that Frosty the SNOWman, and Winter Wonderland, although are unlike any of their other output in terms of ,say, indecipherable lyrics, they definitely have that unmistakeable Cocteau sound
MirrorImage
Nov-12-11, 11:29 PM
Errrr ... Snow is the title of the E.P. .. lets say the tracks on it aren't the usual CT fare :giggle:
Oh, thanks for the correction. I'm still getting familiar with their EPs.
MirrorImage
Nov-15-11, 5:02 PM
I listened to both Milk & Kisses and Four-Calender Cafe and I'm not impressed. What in the world happened to this great band? If I had to choose between these two recordings Milk & Kisses is better, but I even find so much wrong with it that picking between the two almost seems futile.
Right now, I've been enjoying Lullabies To Violaine, Volume 1.
agcu418
Nov-15-11, 5:12 PM
I listened to both Milk & Kisses and Four-Calender Cafe and I'm not impressed. What in the world happened to this great band? If I had to choose between these two recordings Milk & Kisses is better, but I even find so much wrong with it that picking between the two almost seems futile.
Right now, I've been enjoying Lullabies To Violaine, Volume 1.
Just keep listening and the magic will begin to resonate :heart:
MirrorImage
Nov-15-11, 6:30 PM
Just keep listening and the magic will begin to resonate :heart:
I hope so. :)
MirrorImage
Nov-15-11, 7:54 PM
Is it me or do you think Cocteau Twins should have disbanded after Heaven Or Los Vegas? One thing terribly wrong with Four-Calender Cafe and Milk & Kisses is they're just overproduced I think. They sound too smooth. Cocteau Twins doesn't really work IMHO without some kind of edge to them. For example, listen to Pink Orange Red and then listen to Summerhead, while Summerhead has a great feel, it doesn't have the Cocteau Twins edginess to it that is found in Pink Orange Red.
I think I'll just stick to their early output.
randomrob
Nov-15-11, 8:40 PM
HOLV is edgy? The edge wore off after Love's Easy Tears, imo.
MirrorImage
Nov-15-11, 8:54 PM
HOLV is edgy? The edge wore off after Love's Easy Tears, imo.
Perhaps, I shouldn't have applied the adjective edgy to Heaven Or Los Vegas. I should have said that everything after Heaven Or Los Vegas was less inspired. :)
MirrorImage
Nov-16-11, 12:21 AM
I didn't think it was possible but as much I dislike Garlands, I'm beginning to dislike Four-Calender Cafe even more. Tried to listen to it again earlier tonight and I turned it down and quickly remedied it with Victorialand. Now there's an album. As soon as Lazy Calm started, I said to myself "Ah, now this is what the Cocteau Twins's sound like when they hit their stride."
This said, I think every band eventually burns out, especially one as gifted as the Cocteau Twins, but for them to think Four-Calender Cafe and Milk & Kisses were worth releasing is beyond me. Anyway, I'm done ranting...:)
Dpressed
Nov-16-11, 5:21 AM
I used to rant about 4CC & M&K .. but after listening to M&K earlier this year I've had a re-assesment ... yes its not brilliant, but it is a step up from 4CC.
& I still defend Garlands ... but then I started with Treasure & heard Garlands & HoH before I bought Victorialand
fornasetti
Nov-16-11, 6:58 AM
M&k is great, especially the double climax at the end.
Musette
Nov-16-11, 7:54 AM
M&K really has some lovely shining moments.
4CC to me...does not. :666:
Quisquose
Nov-16-11, 9:49 AM
:slapfight:
I'm one of the lonely few who loves 4CC. It's a somber and solitary life... ;)
Dpressed
Nov-16-11, 10:33 AM
As I said earlier in the thread, one reason I'm :smitten: with CT is that there are so many different opinions from their 'hardcore fans'.
I'm on Kate Bush forums & whilst people disagree over many of her releases I'd say that over 90% think the The Dreaming is her best album. But with CT you'll find someone who will stick up for every album whilst disliking one that others love.
& :comfort: to Qq .. stick to your guns girl
MirrorImage
Nov-16-11, 11:58 AM
I used to rant about 4CC & M&K .. but after listening to M&K earlier this year I've had a re-assesment ... yes its not brilliant, but it is a step up from 4CC.
& I still defend Garlands ... but then I started with Treasure & heard Garlands & HoH before I bought Victorialand
It's interesting that I started with Garlands, but the second recording I heard was Victorialand. I've never bothered with Garlands again. Just like I'm never going to bother with Four-Calender Cafe again. I'll probably revisit Milk & Kisses soon, but that's only to refresh my memory and to see if I like it this time around.
Victorialand, Blue Bell Knoll, Head Over Heels, Heaven Or Los Vegas, and their early EPs, especially made around '84 through '85 are the reasons I continue to listen to Cocteau Twins.
davespear
Nov-16-11, 5:16 PM
FCC is perhaps too 'pop' for some, but I don't dislike it, 'know who you are', ;summerhead',and 'pur' are my faves along with 'my truth' which I think is SO sexy sounding
MirrorImage
Nov-16-11, 10:22 PM
FCC is perhaps too 'pop' for some, but I don't dislike it, 'know who you are', ;summerhead',and 'pur' are my faves along with 'my truth' which I think is SO sexy sounding
Summerhead is a very good song and has great feel. That I will admit, but just can't get into Four-Calender Cafe. I think this album just showed a lack of inspiration and the same with Milk & Kisses.
Anyway, listening to Heaven Or Las Vegas. Beautiful recording. Listening to the song Road, River and Rail. I :heart: this song. :) But, hell, the whole album is fantastic. I can't believe somebody said they didn't like the title track on the "Favorite CT song" thread. What in the world?
randomrob
Nov-16-11, 11:46 PM
:slapfight:
I'm one of the lonely few who loves 4CC. It's a somber and solitary life... ;)
No I like 4CC too.. it's just it's a very confessional album. It's touchy feely and understandable and thats definitely a turn after years of inscrutable art music. But I don't get the whole 'pop' inference at all. Bluebeard, yes, (it makes me wince) but not the lyrics, which are counseling session material... nailed more elegantly in Know Who You Are...
I think Oil of Angels and Essence are wonderful tracks.
I don't think it's a great album, but I think it's a more interesting and experimental album than HOLV.. which is pretty and homogenous sounding and forgettable, imo.
MirrorImage
Nov-17-11, 12:13 AM
I don't think it's a great album, but I think it's a more interesting and experimental album than HOLV.. which is pretty and homogenous sounding and forgettable, imo.
I strongly disagree...
I don't think Four-Calender Cafe is more interesting than Heaven Or Los Vegas. The songwriting is so much more creative and inspired than anything on Four-Calender Cafe.
How could you forget songs like Frou-frou Foxes In Midsummer Fires, the title track, Iceblink Luck, I Wear Your Ring, Road, River and Rail, or Cherry-coloured Funk?
MirrorImage
Nov-17-11, 12:49 AM
Another album I don't return to very often is Treasure. It does have some good songs on it, but not enough to keep me coming back on a regular basis. I :heart: Otterley though. I'm not sure how anybody else feels about this song, but it puts me in another world entirely.
My favorite CT albums: Victorialand, Blue Bell Knoll, and Heaven Or Los Vegas. I also like Head Over Heels quite a bit.
winters
Nov-17-11, 1:01 AM
4CC has some wonderful moments - Pur is a winner. HOLV was my first love - so i listened to it a lot - not so much now, although Frou-Frou can give me the chills. Victorialand is my usual nowadays for CT albums. On Treasure - Pandora is amazing.
MirrorImage, it's been nice to have a fresh voice here - I would love to hear your take on the live stuff.
MirrorImage
Nov-17-11, 1:05 AM
4CC has some wonderful moments - Pur is a winner. HOLV was my first love - so i listened to it a lot - not so much now, although Frou-Frou can give me the chills. Victorialand is my usual nowadays for CT albums. On Treasure - Pandora is amazing.
MirrorImage, it's been nice to have a fresh voice here - I would love to hear your take on the live stuff.
Thanks, winters.
I haven't heard any of their live performances. Do they have live recordings available? I know they have the BBC Sessions, but this can't be counted as a "live" album as it was done in a studio.
randomrob
Nov-17-11, 7:41 AM
How could you forget songs like Frou-frou Foxes In Midsummer Fires, the title track, Iceblink Luck, I Wear Your Ring, Road, River and Rail, or Cherry-coloured Funk?
Different strokes, man. Those tracks all blur together like cherry colored slush to me. HOLV to me is their commercial breakout album, it's the one I heard the most being played by people who'd never heard them before at college, so it was the album I quickly got used to and put down fastest.
Give it 10 years, you'll get 4CC better. Everybody hates that album at first.
Give it 10 years, you'll get 4CC better. Everybody hates that album at first.
Agree.
Quisquose
Nov-17-11, 10:38 AM
Everybody hates that album at first.
Not me, I actually did like it from the start. ;) Know who you are at every age grabbed me by the heart the first time I heard it and I've never gotten over it.
I do remember that I did NOT like Bluebeard (country?! wtf?) and thought Evangeline was the most boring thing I'd ever heard, but they grew on me over years and now I love them both.
Bluebeard is just a different sound, like a bit of experimentation, and it has a breezy, wistful feeling. Which is ironic considering how Liz has said it was a "very angry" song, and how Robin has said he was so fucked up and dysfunctional during the entire recording.
Evangeline is just full of space and gorgeousness and sadness.
MirrorImage
Nov-17-11, 11:48 AM
Different strokes, man. Those tracks all blur together like cherry colored slush to me. HOLV to me is their commercial breakout album, it's the one I heard the most being played by people who'd never heard them before at college, so it was the album I quickly got used to and put down fastest.
Give it 10 years, you'll get 4CC better. Everybody hates that album at first.
Well not everybody's first Cocteau Twins album was Heaven Or Los Vegas. My first album was Garlands and I found this album dreadful. I was lucky that Victorialand was the second album I heard. I'm glad Four-Calender Cafe wasn't the second album I heard or I would have probably never bothered with their music again. :)
But, yes, different strokes. You like Four-Calender Cafe and I dislike it, so let's just leave it at that.
Ghosty
Nov-17-11, 12:30 PM
Another album I don't return to very often is Treasure. It does have some good songs on it, but not enough
Sacrilege.
randomrob
Nov-17-11, 4:48 PM
Sacrilege.
in 1986, maybe :coffee:
winters
Nov-17-11, 10:15 PM
Thanks, winters.
I haven't heard any of their live performances. Do they have live recordings available? I know they have the BBC Sessions, but this can't be counted as a "live" album as it was done in a studio.
On the MP3 Swept threads, I'd get Portsmouth 86 (amazing Pink Orange Red!) and Detroit 90 - good mixes - there are other gems out there - Albert Hall 96 is a poor mix but has some great moments.
MirrorImage
Nov-17-11, 10:24 PM
On the MP3 Swept threads, I'd get Portsmouth 86 (amazing Pink Orange Red!) and Detroit 90 - good mixes - there are other gems out there - Albert Hall 96 is a poor mix but has some great moments.
Thanks for the info, but I was thinking more on the lines of an actual commercial recording.
MirrorImage
Nov-17-11, 10:25 PM
Sacrilege.
Could very well be, but I think for someone not to like Victorialand or Blue Bell Knoll is sacrilege. ;) But as Randomrob says different strokes.
winters
Nov-17-11, 11:17 PM
Thanks for the info, but I was thinking more on the lines of an actual commercial recording.
No, I don't think there are any - sad - . they are definitely a studio band - that attention to layered detail is hard to capture live I think, but the live material I mentioned have some of my favorite recordings by them - I'd check it out - unless you have an anti-bootleg stance - which I can understand...
MirrorImage
Nov-17-11, 11:22 PM
No, I don't think there are any - sad - . they are definitely a studio band - that attention to layered detail is hard to capture live I think, but the live material I mentioned have some of my favorite recordings by them - I'd check it out - unless you have an anti-bootleg stance - which I can understand...
Yeah, I don't think hearing them live is the ideal sound-world for them either. Like you said, that layered, textural sound, especially with Robin Guthrie's guitar work and Fraser's multi-layered vocals. I mean can you imagine a song like Suckling the Mender, for example, being pulled off live? That would be incredibly difficult.
randomrob
Nov-18-11, 12:23 AM
I can't listen to any of the live recordings.
Quisquose
Nov-18-11, 10:21 AM
There are no official concert recordings released, but check out "The BBC Sessions" double album. The tracks on the 2nd disc particularly do a good job of capturing their live sound, I think. They really showcase how good Liz could sound without multi-tracking.
MirrorImage
Nov-18-11, 11:45 AM
There are no official concert recordings released, but check out "The BBC Sessions" double album. The tracks on the 2nd disc particularly do a good job of capturing their live sound, I think. They really showcase how good Liz could sound without multi-tracking.
The BBC Sessions are the only recordings I'm missing, but I'm not too interested in these. I understand that the set is out-of-print, but it probably could be found easily in the used market.
Ghosty
Nov-18-11, 11:45 AM
in 1986, maybe
Sacrilege has no date stamp on it. Ye unfaithful heathens should burn (or forced to listen to Justin Bieber non-stop for a year).
Ghosty
Nov-18-11, 11:47 AM
I think for someone not to like Victorialand or Blue Bell Knoll is sacrilege.
Those too.
Quisquose
Nov-18-11, 12:00 PM
Thanks for the info, but I was thinking more on the lines of an actual commercial recording.
The BBC Sessions are the only recordings I'm missing, but I'm not too interested in these. I understand that the set is out-of-print, but it probably could be found easily in the used market.
http://weknowmemes.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/are-you-serious-rage-face-240x180.jpg
Dpressed
Nov-18-11, 2:13 PM
I agree with Ghosty ... Treasure is gorgeous
mike_mhg
Nov-18-11, 3:00 PM
...and I think you're going to LOVE Sigh's Smell of Farewell. Pure magic.
It was the Loves Easy Tears EP that made me totally devoted to the band.
randomrob
Nov-18-11, 3:01 PM
It was the Loves Easy Tears EP that made me totally devoted to the band.
yes
davespear
Nov-19-11, 4:23 AM
Sacrilege has no date stamp on it. Ye unfaithful heathens should burn (or forced to listen to Justin Bieber non-stop for a year).
yes indeed, if one accepts that CT's music is timeless, or that they were well ahead of their time, then you can't bracket them as just an 80's/9o's sound
And look at how newbies keep coming along, often quite young people discovering the magic for the first time.
Garlands (which I like) is perhaps the only output of theirs that you could say was dated, and interestingly, it is perhaps the one album that appeals the least
winters
Nov-19-11, 10:32 AM
And look at how newbies keep coming along, often quite young people discovering the magic for the first time.
Yes, that is a wonderful thing to see, for me - similar to meeting someone who's just gotten into Nick Drake.
randomrob
Nov-19-11, 4:10 PM
yes indeed, if one accepts that CT's music is timeless, or that they were well ahead of their time, then you can't bracket them as just an 80's/9o's sound
yes/yes/no :coffee: and if only because NOTHING as creatively put together as CT is coming out right now.. so to me, they HAVE to be from the late 80s/early 90s..
tangent: Evanescence winning artist of the year back in whenever was for me the JFK assassination of the american music scene... been downhill ever since, except for the indies.
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