CT and Emotional Health

[spanglemaker]

It has been said that a lot of "gay" people listen to the cocteau twins. I wanted to address now that there are alot of people with mental anguish or have suffered some trauma during their life and inadvertantly have found solace in the music of Cocteau Twins....how true is this? what is your angle or point of view on this?


For me....yes it is true I have ptsd (post traumatic stress disorder) and the only thing that kept me alive when I was a teenager between attempts to take my life....was ct music

I also happen to be bisexual so that is a double whamee! any connection there that you can see? what are your thoughts?

[Brittany]

A traumatic situation is exactly how and why I was "turned on". Personally I think it can be compared to people who heal by meditating. Allowing for some sort of escapism to calm down and put things back into perspective. Hey, it's better than Paxil if you ask me.

[mmmender]

i think that most music which can be classified as 'introspective' can satisfy the needs of those who seek just that. again it comes back to the topic of cocteau twins belonging to a genre of music which never seems to fit into the mainstream, its followers tend to sit happily in the margins. if solace is what you seek and you find it in cocteaus music then wonderful, but many find solace in beethoven or pink floyd....each of us has our own unique needs and desires, we should only be thankful that it can often be pacified, healed or dealt with through music. this isn't yanni we're talking about here, i don't think that the cocteaus offer up a platter of self-help.....it's just nice if you're able to get from it what you need. and if you find yourself relating to what liz has to say (as many often do) then it just makes it that much more special!

maybe i'm talking through my arse again, i dunno! :rolleyes:

[zed]

MMM...........


no, madam....you are perfectly clear.
and quite correct, as i see it.



:) z.

[Brittany]

Reading my post, it sounds like I am sitting cross legged on the floor humming or chanting. Oops, my bad. Not that it's a bad thing if you do, it's just not my piece of tiramisu. But at the same time, it almost appears as if that's what it was to me. Instead of going ballistic or doing something stupid, I just put on Loves Easy Tears or Blue Bell Knoll and screamed it all out into my pillow. I never got Liz's lyrics (sadly) until HOLV-where it was only bits and pieces. But without sounding silly, it was right along the lines of what others have said here...it was the feeling that came across. I left a disc (Moon and the Melodies) at a friends house who was going through some heart-wrenching stuff, and when she went into the guest room I was staying in and kicked on the stereo to stifle her crying, guess what came on? She comes out over an hour later and the first thing out of her mouth was "WHO was that?" and "can I have it?". She now claims that CT got her through a nasty divorce and child custody battle. Soothing. I have a handful of stories just like that.

[Lucibelle]

Music soothes the savage beast!

[watchlar]

Originally posted by spanglemaker
It has been said that a lot of "gay" people listen to the cocteau twins.

just to clarify...i hope you're not suggesting that gay individuals suffer from more mental anguish than heterosexual individuals...i'm guessing that's not what you meant... :)

anyways...yes it's definitely healing music...i would say that FCC came out during the most difficult time in my life and helped me through so much.

Watchy

[spanglemaker]

No Watchy I was using that as an example....the gay bit

For me it was a connection that I just "knew" what she was going through. I could hear the rage and the hurt. That soothed me to know that I was not the only one. Of course at the time that was all in my mind but as she later interviewed and said all that she said about her abuse and rape, well it all made sense to me. I felt like I was right all along. A sense of Validation. It is so hard to get that now a days.

I have known other people say that the music has brought them to happiness. It never gave me happiness it gave me understanding and solace. I suffered through a crisis for 16 years. imagine that. and the trauma is not until now. can you believe that I still find solace, validation and understanding in their music?

on that note, I am the one of two females on a construction crew(yes I am the strongest alpha female, lol) anyway one day at lunch time I just needed to hear some VI or CT. I popped in FCC.
the guys all about threw up and said "WTF, is that?" but I told them I would lower the volume...to my amazment they said "No let's hear it." now these guys are a bunch of huge teddy bear men, you know? Lunch was over and we all seemed a little more relaxed. The next day the biggest of all the guys, about 6'5" and 340 pounds came up to me and said.."Would you play your lullibies again?" lol lol lol He didn't mean to make fun of it. He just didn't know who or what to call it. I did and we were relaxed again. Of course the other female being a pianist at her local churched loooooved it and asked me to burn her a copy......

cool story ain't it? anyone else?

[watchlar]

That is a beautiful story!!!!


W

[someotherian]

watchy,
you have to take the prize for the longest sig i've ever seen! :)
plus you have good taste. twin peaks, right?

ok back to the thread... and just to be perverse i have to say that when i'm in a low emotional state i usually find it hard to listen to any kind of music, ct or otherwise. it's usually a case of my state of mind not allowing me to think clearly enough about what (if anything) i might want to listen to.

[Brittany]

FIRE WALK WITH ME. That is definitely one of my all time favorite films. Applause on the good taste.

[mmmender]

david lynch just kicks my ass all over the place!!

[ScottL]

My 2 cents, I think CT music is appealing to introspective individuals and generally is soothing all around. So I believe, IF you have some emotional trauma etc, CT would be well called for, but I don't think CT appeal is limitted to that. While one(not me!) might argue that we all have some deep seated emotional angst/sadness or something that CT calls to...I don't think that is necessarily the case. I don't have any specific trauma that lead me to CT. I just think it is wonderfully beautiful. The closest thing might be depression, but that really hasn't been a constant factor...like any bad event that happens...listening to CT feels better...
At times, I also enjoy somber music or music that demands some level of patience...things people often called 'depressing' I considered quite comforting. When I happen to be sad, music that is somber but beautiful generally makes me feel better.
Main point is my emotional reception of CT is strong all around, happy or sad.

[zed]

well.

they've never saved me from a crisis,

i'm not "obsessed" in the hardcore definition of the word,

i sometimes don't listen to them for, oh, a day or two.(lol)

i can tell you why i love the sounds they made, if you've got several hours.but...............

to tell the truth......they just make me happy.

period.


happy.

that's enough for me.

;) Z.

[Lucibelle]

Some people just do not understand how something that sounds like the Cocteau Twins could actually envoke a sense of ease and harmony. Often these people are high strung and if music brings them 'down' from that, then 'down' is how they feel. Sometimes a song with sorrow, whoever it's by, can be comforting if only to know that someone else out there admits to feeling sorrow. Sometimes the music just puts you in a trance. Sometimes it reaches, somehow, the inner-most part of your soul. Even if you don't know how it did.

Luci

[REPLICESS]

One of my fav moments at college was a few months ago. We were in the studio for a 'Production analysis' lesson in which we get to bring CD's fropm home to play to the group. I played 'Dear Heart' and although whispering & shuffling is usually the thing - the whole room was still and calm - they were transfixed ! We spent 1/2 discussing and breaking the track down. My lecturer - Martin Colley - is an ex Radio 1 engineer who has spent time in 'September Sound' and worked with Robin, so had lots to say on the subject. Over the following week I was lending out C/T cds all over the place! One of my fellow students has since covered 'Dear Heart', although I'm yet to hear it :)

_________________________________________


http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HEADOVERHEELS/

[Lucibelle]

That's so cool! I love that story! :)

[mmmender]

*bump*

[kookaburra]

Amen!

[Synesthesia]

CT makes me feel drunk and happy. Warm and high. Especially Three Swept. Feels like spring.

[Rad]

All I can say is that my first few months of CT would have had to be the most divine of my life. (Not that I believe in divinity).
But everything that was bad about me disappeared. I didn't feel like my old self and I thought I'd be happy for the rest of my life. I actually thought I found the 'answer'.
Anyway, CT may have not been the 'answer' but they definately 'point the way' to whatever I'm searching for. I'm not sure what it is but I'm definately searching for something.
(Ya know, everytime I philosophise like this I hear Captain Jack Sparrow in my head "You need to find yourself giiiirrrl, mate")
Yeah well, fuck him. For a while there, CT taught me that you can be completely alone in the universe but completely...complete, and infinitely happy with absolutely no one to sooth your pain... if only for a few months.
But those times are still a sign of hope to me. One day maybe I'll master that 'state of mind' that CT helped me obtain.

[iceblink555]

I don't think I've ever put on any CT music specifically for therapeutic purposes, but I know that when I've been extremely depressed, and happened to put on some CT, it really "spoke" to me. I found this to be especially true in my early CT days (late '80's/early '90's). I can remember a few emotionally trying times when some of the lyrics (which I normally don't try to literally interpret) took on very clear and significant meaning for me.

--Alan

[Jeek]

Well spanglemaker, I am gay and the proud owner of my very own case of manic depression. Usually when I'm down, music is very helpful, and as Cocteaus goes, it's tracks like Carolyn's Fingers, Summerhead, and Bluebeard that do it for me, plus Those Eyes, that Mouth and Orange Appled. However, when I was severely depressed (to the point of needing to be institutionalised) I didn't want any music around me. I had no interest in it whatsoever, which was really strange, and to those around me, really frightening.

[ped]

Originally posted by Lucibelle
Music soothes the savage beast!

Hehe the actual phrase is like:

"Music hath charms to soothe the savage breast"

Not beast, though I know it's been perverted into that recently by most people who have misheard it.

[Colin]

Great topic, and one I have pondered before. As several mentioned, music in general is catharctic, but I noticed early on as I came to know other Cocteau fans that a disproportionate share seemed to be introspective/outsider types with intense emotional lives. So I do think there is some special appeal of CTs for people who know life's emotions with intensity.

The "thing" they offer may be different for each of us, but for me personally I think I find a great deal of suffused/suppressed anger (sometimes rage) in the music and the vocals as well. But particularly important to my appreciation of the vocals is the wordlessness with which Liz communicates strong emotion so clearly. Many of us dealing with an emotional issue cannot always find words to express them -- all I know some days is I just feel anger (or relieved or hopeful) but have no frickin' idea where it's coming from or why. Most other music seeks to wrap contexts around an emotional experience -- I'm angry cuz my boyfriend left me, I'm happy cuz I met a new guy, etc., etc. . . But with Liz its just pure anger, pure joy, utter confusion -- whatever -- so I don't have to necessarily identify with a song's "story line" to have the catharctic experience.

To be a bit less analytic (which I over-do), I sense a kind of alienation or ostracism in their music and vocals that I definately identify with. I can't put my finger on where that comes from -- maybe the lack of language, the anger -- but I feel they know this feeling of alienation. Anyone else sense that, or am I alone in this??;)

[ResetTwo]

Originally posted by ped
Hehe the actual phrase is like:

"Music hath charms to soothe the savage breast"

Not beast, though I know it's been perverted into that recently by most people who have misheard it.

nothing like changing a centuries old phrase because kids can't stop giggling at the word 'breast'

[Pixie]

The CT have had a profound impact in my life.

I too am gay (lesbian) but with a few bi-sexual tendacies. And I was turned onto the CT by a lesbian around 1990. But Spangle, I think nearly everyone in this world is bi-sexual...my theory on this would take a lot of reading/writing, but yet alone, it's my beliefs. *note* I respect everyone elses.

I listen to them in most of all states of mind and being. There was a time when my life started to really make sence to me(1996)...the answers came to me after recalling some abuse yet alone what I already had known...but why I had always been so depressed and very different from others...just everything at that time seemed to give me a clue or an answer in understanding why and who I am.

But during that time and to make a long story short...I decided to leave everyone in my life behind to discover me without negative influances and quit doing the things I knew were destroying me. I ended up moving out and although I had an option to live in a vacant house that was offered to me by my bro and I was making about a grand a week...I chose to live in my car (showering at the gym I belonged to) because it was the only way I knew I couldn't and wouldn't escape from me. I did this for two months until I moved to California...actually leaving without knowing where I was going. But I listened to the CT about 90% of the time right before, during and after at that time.

[Pixie]

p.s.

And how do I say this right??? It's ironic and it's what just occured to me...in regards to speaking about the impact of the CT during the time before and after I left Ohio....here I am back in my home town reconnecting and here I am connecting with this forum that I've never thought to visit before until a month ago neither have I ever found a forum with as many real people and people I can identify with in regards to realism. Okay...I'm going to shut-up.

[willy]

So true, funny how it seems. To cut a long story short I lost my mind.

[iceblink555]

Colin,

I agree with a lot of what you've said. I think the reason why a lot of us do identify so much emotionally with CT is because what Liz expresses is more abstract, not tied so closely to the specifics of her situation.

--Alan

[dannen]

By no means do I purport myself to be a CT expert IN ANY MANNER but reading through many interviews w/ Liz/CT as I have it’s pretty clear that she has had her times of being pretty far out of control nuts. After reading that was the case it helped me understand why I'd always felt so ‘at home’ with CT music.

I think many of the world’s true geniuses, just like many of us ‘non-geniuses’, have gone through the same thing (Tricky also has had his dances w/ the devil), although I’m certainly not saying they are specifically directly related. But then again, for some perhaps they are. Maybe loosing it all includes loosing the road-signs that lead you in the wrong direction allowing you to, if it may be the case, stumble on to the right ones.

I’ve had similar experiences to many of those expressed here and I very much value that sense of ‘unity’ (to be somewhat melodramatic) with others that have faced the same fire. My personal demons included stages of complete loss of control of how to direct my mind, resulting in obsessive (though thankfully not harmful or dangerous) thoughts. I would spend 3 hours repeating (in my head, not verbally) 4 or 5 random words over and over and over and not even know it was happening until I’d catch myself at the end of the 3rd or 4th (or whatever) hour. At times I felt as alone and isolated as the mind can stand (as I'm sure we all have). Thoughts of feeling better off if it would all just stop, everything, permanently, just stop.

I think Colin illuminated it wonderfully...

Originally posted by Colin
The "thing" they offer may be different for each of us, but for me personally I think I find a great deal of suffused/suppressed anger (sometimes rage) in the music and the vocals as well. But particularly important to my appreciation of the vocals is the wordlessness with which Liz communicates strong emotion so clearly. Many of us dealing with an emotional issue cannot always find words to express them -- all I know some days is I just feel anger (or relieved or hopeful) but have no frickin' idea where it's coming from or why. Most other music seeks to wrap contexts around an emotional experience -- I'm angry cuz my boyfriend left me, I'm happy cuz I met a new guy, etc., etc. . . But with Liz its just pure anger, pure joy, utter confusion -- whatever -- so I don't have to necessarily identify with a song's "story line" to have the catharctic experience.

To be a bit less analytic (which I over-do), I sense a kind of alienation or ostracism in their music and vocals that I definately identify with. I can't put my finger on where that comes from -- maybe the lack of language, the anger -- but I feel they know this feeling of alienation.

To get to your direct point, yes, I think there is a connection (for many of us) with CT music and what difficulties the listener may have gone through in their life.

I personally didn't have CT music at those times in my life. But I did have other music that provided the same oasis that CT does. It seems to understand and at the same time admit that it doesn't understand anything at all. By providing that honesty I think it helps us truly own the strengths we have and feel less vulnerable about the strengths we don't have (or perhaps to be ok w/ our vulnerabilities).

I believe that CT music and it's connection w/ mental health (for many of us) you are questioning is a very valid and accurate question.

For me, 'yes' is the answer, they are connected. CT music is one of the invisible lillypads I managed to find that kept me from falling in.

[blueeyed1]

yes spanglemaker that was a beautiful story...BUT, you no longer work on a construction site.You were actually taking a class on construction maybe a little more than a year ago and attempted to build a house with your class...You just stopped going to school and the so called construction site..And all the so called men in your class were really young and not really big guys so i don't know where you got that 340 pound guy from... And as i recall you listened to the radio station and some of their rap cd's so i don't know why you would say that you played CT ....Some people tell really good stories don't they?... Oh and since when have you really become a bisexual when i was told that you only had a couple experiences with men that weren't really worth it..

[Avninder]

I think there's something primordial about the Twins. It is a different type of communication that is unfettered by the concrete preciseness of words. I suppose what Liz is able to do vocally is exactly what we feel ourselves and at one time or another wished we could share with others witout missing it all by pinning it down with words. Using words to do such a thing is much like using push pins to show a dead butterfly in flight.

My association to this question is my highschool days when I was in love with a girl who I thought could never love me back. Like highschool crushes, to me she was perfect. I remember making her a tape with a few tracks of the Twins on it. I thought I could slip a few in without seeming too strange. Of course she liked it, I knew she would. I suppose that even though I could not tell her at the time, at least she could hear and enjoy some music that embodied all that I felt about her.