23 Envelope - V23 - Vaughan Oliver

[mmmender]

http://www.evo.org/html/gif/23Envelope.gif

[ScottL]

hmm...I went with the most factual response...which is that I only like their CT cover's...since that is all I have seen, that I know of...

[petroldarling]

as did i, as i am not familiar with their other work except for the twins.

as a side note, i love your new avatar, leesa, you are really beautiful :D

[Doomie]

Is this a trick question? Well I guess I'm just askin if you are refering specifically to 23 envelope stuff or if the question is meant to include all the V23 stuff as well? I voted for it all regardless, tho I dunno if I like ALL of it, it's still the answer that fits best.

[Pale Clouded]

23 Envelope, V23 same difference, I love the work! It's why I went to Design school...as I've said before.......

[Pale Clouded]

How could any one talk about graphic design of the last 20 years without mentioning something about Vaughan Oliver? Oliver's works focuses on sobriety and weirdness, but its weirdness has a uniqueness that is just plain beautiful. Without doubt, he is one of the most important graphic designers to come out of Britain in the last 20 years and his influence can be seen far and wide.

With the photographer, Nigel Grierson, Oliver set up the design company, 23 envelope in the early 80s; rechristened v23) in 1988 after Grierson's departure. Within its own structure, he deeply influenced the sleeve design area during the 80'. Mostly working for the label 4AD, designing sleeves for Ultra Vivid Scene, Clan of Xymox, Frank Black, Pixies, Cocteau Twins, This Mortal Coil (see their Filigree & Shadow cover), Robert Fripp and many others, Vaughan Oliver has even a wider palette than Brody or Emigre's people: he is not just a graphist; he is a real art director, either skilled for graphic design or typography than for photography. Working with talented photographers, he masters the whole process, from conceiving pictures to the final lay-out



Taken From: http://www.leninimports.com/vaughanoliver1.html#vobio1

[mmmender]

Originally posted by allimart
as did i, as i am not familiar with their other work except for the twins.

as a side note, i love your new avatar, leesa, you are really beautiful :D

thanks very much alli, you are very beautiful yourself!

:)

[willy]

Originally posted by allimart
as a side note, i love your new avatar, leesa, you are really beautiful :D

Yeah, I think so too. Leesa I'm cooking a chicken curry tonight and there's a bottle of wine in the fridge if you fancy popping round.

[willy]

Filigree & Shadow is the one. Especially on vinyl. Goodness!

[Phil Lawton]

There should be an option of "I've only ever seen their CT covers".

Vaughan Oliver....didn't he play scrum-half for Lllanelli?

[willy]

Originally posted by Phil Lawton
Vaughan Oliver....didn't he play scrum-half for Lllanelli?

You're thinking of Bjorn Waldegaard, the Swedish rally driver.

[Phil Lawton]

Originally posted by willy
You're thinking of Bjorn Waldegaard, the Swedish rally driver.

They're so easy to confuse.

So...Bjorn Waldegaard, the Swedish rally driver, played scrum-half for Llanelli?

Who did Vaughan Oliver play for?

[willy]

Partick Thistle.

[lo-fi]

Phil , i thaught he played fly half

[postlibyan]

i will have to admit -- i am not all that up on the V23 work. does he still do albums? if so, coudl someone list a few, or point me to a web listing of current album covers.

thanks.

PJK

[Phil Lawton]

Originally posted by willy
Partick Thistle.

Use tweezers to remove the barb.

[Phil Lawton]

Originally posted by lo-fi
Phil , i thaught he played fly half

Wasn't that either Geoff Goldblum or Vincent Price?

[willy]

Originally posted by Phil Lawton
Use tweezers to remove the barb.

I usually handle it with tweezers anyway.

[Phil Lawton]

Originally posted by willy
I usually handle it with tweezers anyway.

Very wise...rubber gloves and a blow-torch woldn't go amiss either.

How is Derek Nimmo these days?

[willy]

I have a big problem with spelks.

[Phil Lawton]

Originally posted by willy
I have a big problem with spelks.

Who doesn't? Little bastards...running around the patio, nesting in the eaves, leaving their fur-balls everywhere and making that odd whining noise when you shoo them out of the airing cupboard.

I blame the Liberals.

[Jeek]

When Belly released "King" in 1995, one of the British music mags made some comment about killing Tanya Donelly by downloading her into a Mac and letting Vaughn Oliver design her to death...

[mmmender]

Originally posted by willy
Yeah, I think so too. Leesa I'm cooking a chicken curry tonight and there's a bottle of wine in the fridge if you fancy popping round.

wine and indian food? what time?!

[Brett]

Yes but it's hard to pick wine to go with Indian food don't you think?


I vote, I really rated 23 Envelope all the while I used to buy 4AD stuff. Since then, I really couldn't say. Have to concur with Pale Clouded though. Vaughan Oliver is a tremendous talent. I also love Peter Saville of Joy Division, OMD, Ultravox, New Order....etc fame. Couldn't choose between em quite frankly and after all, why should I?!

[iceblink555]

I'm in the same boat as PJ. I've only (knowingly) seen 23e's CT work, plus the TMC covers.

Anyone care to post some IMG links to some of their non-CT stuff?

--Alan

[Iwan]

Scans:
http://quimby.gnus.org/html/uwpjpeglist.html

Discography:
http://quimby.gnus.org/eyesore.html

[iceblink555]

Thanks for the links, Iwan.

Yeah, OK, I've seen some of the other 23e/v23 stuff before then. Doesn't seem like any of it has impressed me nearly as much as the CT covers tho. But then maybe there's some inherent bias there since I love what's inside those CT sleeves so much!

--Alan

[willy]

Originally posted by mmmender
wine and indian food? what time?!

Just come over. I'll just give the willy a quick wash and put on my disco pants.

[postlibyan]

Iwan --

So this Vaughn Oliver person did _all_ of those sleeves? Really?

well, if so then i gotta disagree with Alan here: i am fond of the Red House Painters sleeves very much. the washed out photographs really go well with the music. and the Pixies album covers are classic....

so i guess i do like his current work as well! who knew?

thanks much for the linkage.

PJK

[Pale Clouded]

Originally posted by postlibyan
Iwan --

So this Vaughn Oliver person did _all_ of those sleeves? Really?

well, if so then i gotta disagree with Alan here: i am fond of the Red House Painters sleeves very much. the washed out photographs really go well with the music. and the Pixies album covers are classic....

so i guess i do like his current work as well! who knew?

thanks much for the linkage.

PJK

No Vaughn and Co. didn't do all of those covers. Like the Dead Can Dance covers, he didn't do those. Some others as well. He did do most though.

[willy]

Originally posted by postlibyan
So this Vaughn Oliver person did _all_ of those sleeves? Really?

well, if so then i gotta disagree with Alan here: i am fond of the Red House Painters sleeves very much. the washed out photographs really go well with the music. and the Pixies album covers are classic....


As a designer meself, CT and TMC score the highest on my Sex-ometer. But I have nothing but admiration for his Colourbox, Le Mystere des Voix Bulgares, Belly, Breeders and Pixies. And I haven't even mentioned Lush and Heidi Berry. And David Sylvian. Let's face it the man is not only pretty good but a fellow baldy too.

[Iwan]

Yep... sorry for the confusion. It is really a 4AD listing of covers, and not everything has been done by 23 Envelope/v23. Also, Vaughan didn't do everything by himself. As said before, 23 Envelope was a combination between Vaughan and Nigel Grierson, a photographer. Therefore, most photos you'll see on covers in the period 1981-1988 are from Nigel, he also directed all videos (except 1 I believe) for the Lonely Is An Eyesore video. Vaughan's work in that period consisted more of art direction as well as typography. He's really good when it comes to the latter IMHO.

Dead Can Dance did their own sleeves, apart from some minor contributions by v23 personnel. The Twins infamously didn't want to work with Vaughan after 1987's LIAE. Bauhaus never worked with 23 Envelope I believe. In the last 5 years or so, the partnership with 4AD has been abandoned and v23 now serves more as a regular contractor which leads to less involvement with current artists.

Also, Colourbox apparently hated Vaughan's work and would rather have had something completely different. I love the sleeves though...

Postlibyan... if you like the first 3 Pixies albums as well as the RHP ones.... They are all photographed by Simon Larbalestier. Very good photographer... his website:
http://www.simon-larbalestier.co.uk/


And Vaughan supports Sunderland... he designed the footie's club 7" sleeve as well.

[Jeek]

I'm not sure but something tells me that 23envelope/V23 was not responsible for the BBK cover. I am right? I lent my copy of BBK to a friend, so I can't check myself...

[kookaburra]

g:

It's credited to Juergen Teller, Paul West, and Jeremy Tilston.

[andylama]

Originally posted by Pale Clouded
How could any one talk about graphic design of the last 20 years without mentioning something about Vaughan Oliver? Oliver's works focuses on sobriety and weirdness, but its weirdness has a uniqueness that is just plain beautiful. Without doubt, he is one of the most important graphic designers to come out of Britain in the last 20 years and his influence can be seen far and wide...

:clap: :clap: :clap:

I think the CT stuff is his best, but he also did some stuff I think is staggeringly ugly with touches of boring. Overall though, as a whole, I think his work is AMAAAZING! I recently got the book "Visceral Pleasures" and it is impressive.

When I saw the following cover artworks for the first time, I just about creamed myself right there on the floor of the record store:

- Sunburst and Snowblind / Head Over Heels
- Tiny Dynamine / Echoes in a Shallow Bay
- Treasure
- Victorialand

Of course, my first viewing was back in the days of 12" vinyl, so you got those nice BIG prints...not the sorry little thumbnails afforded by the CD format :(

I am a tremendous fan of his "flower petals frozen in saliva" technique.

I'd REALLY like to know how he did the Tiny Dynamine-era stuff. Photographically speaking, it's beautifully baffling.

To quote Leesa: SQUIRT!

[E-Lo]

Originally posted by andylama
I am a tremendous fan of his "flower petals frozen in saliva" technique. I'd REALLY like to know how he did the Tiny Dynamine-era stuff. Photographically speaking, it's beautifully baffling.


I remember reading that he experimented with various gels to achieve that effect. There's nothing like those beautiful, classic 23e works! v23 era also good, but I find a bit more uneven.

[Jeek]

One of my fave 23envelope covers is Xmal Deutschland's 1987 release, "Viva".

xmal_lp_viva.gif

[BrownBread]

Either him or 23 envelope? Did he drop off the face of the planet or something? Google is no help, and I was trying to get in touch. Thanks in advance. :D

[Simonp]

Either him or 23 envelope? Did he drop off the face of the planet or something? Google is no help, and I was trying to get in touch. Thanks in advance. :D


Have you tried going through 4ad? I know he is freelance now but he still does work for them?

Simon

[dynamine]

all about CT covers(imo)
*ducks*

[Simonp]

I think the V23 stuff is beautiful. Vaughan Oliver is a bit of a genius in my opinion. There is a book of his work for sale on Ebay at the moment if anyone is interested. I think that together Vaughan Oliver and Cocteau Twins were a winning combination and don't think any musician/graphic designer has come close to the sound/visual impact of this particular pairing.

[mmmender]

I think the V23 stuff is beautiful. Vaughan Oliver is a bit of a genius in my opinion. There is a book of his work for sale on Ebay at the moment if anyone is interested. I think that together Vaughan Oliver and Cocteau Twins were a winning combination and don't think any musician/graphic designer has come close to the sound/visual impact of this particular pairing.
actually there are two of his books on sale at the moment: This Rimy River and Visceral Pleasures. keep in mind these days you only ever see the reprint editions of these books and our very own brant (dewdrops) is selling the original numbered edition of TRR.

here's a link to his auction:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=378&item=4506427604

[Simonp]

actually there are two of his books on sale at the moment: This Rimy River and Visceral Pleasures. keep in mind these days you only ever see the reprint editions of these books and our very own brant (dewdrops) is selling the original numbered edition of TRR.

here's a link to his auction:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=378&item=4506427604

I have a copy of the limited edition This Rimy River...it's a beautiful piece of deisgn and well worth the extra money.

[mmmender]

wow, what did you pay for it? if you don't mind me asking.

[Simonp]

wow, what did you pay for it? if you don't mind me asking.

Hi Leesa, I bought it when it originally came out direct from 4AD. I remember there was a masssive delay in getting the books delivered to people because it went through so many design changes. I paid £140.00 I think, can't remember for sure.

[mmmender]

ok for those of you who were looking to get in touch with Vaughan Oliver........

you can contact Jeff fedge@sympatico.ca

Jeff is in contact with Vaughan directly. he has agreed to pass on any email addresses or questions you may have for Vaughan.

[multymfoiled]

Several years ago I went to hear Vaughan lecture at MassART in Boston -- it was amazing, and sort of sad -- he spoke a lot about the "death of vinyl" and how it really limited his artistic expression on music packaging. At one point, he put up the cover of Red House Painters "Down Colorful Hill" on a huge screen, then dimmed the lights and played "24" (I think) while we looked on. Simply breathtaking. He also talked about the technique he used for the cover of "Pink Opaque"...I think it was spilled oil? Anyway, he signed my copy of Lilliput, and I was so blown away I didn't know what to say but "thanks".

[kaini]

They CT's first covers were really part of the magic... Useless to name them, but at a time when CT were not well known in France, I've spent hours looking at every detail of THE SPANGLE MAKER, TREASURE, AIKEA GUINEA, ECHOES, TINY, etc... I was really in love with this artwork. Those done for TMC were really awsome too.

But speaking of 23 enveloppe, I think nobody mentioned the major and open influence Russell Mills (http://www.permanence.de/) has had on Vaughan Oliver. I think they collaborated on a bunch of David Sylvian's records artworks.

(Oh, just remembered that Russell Mills did the BBC sessions cover - quite logical, obviously...).

[by the sea]

http://img225.exs.cx/img225/7790/v2317ey.jpg

[by the sea]

http://img225.exs.cx/img225/7418/garlandsuk1disc13xd.jpg

[by the sea]

http://img225.exs.cx/img225/9034/36eq.jpg

[by the sea]

http://img225.exs.cx/img225/29/cocteautwinspeppermintpigep10b.jpg

[by the sea]

http://img225.exs.cx/img225/7608/hohback213vk.jpg

[by the sea]

http://img225.exs.cx/img225/9133/card315eb.jpg

[by the sea]

http://img225.exs.cx/img225/2949/card217qf.jpg

[by the sea]

http://img225.exs.cx/img225/6462/card1110ig.jpg

[by the sea]

http://img225.exs.cx/img225/728/cocteautwinsthespanglemakerep1.jpg

[by the sea]

http://img225.exs.cx/img225/9715/card412zm.jpg

[by the sea]

http://img225.exs.cx/img225/7421/treasurelpisb214zg.jpg

[by the sea]

http://img225.exs.cx/img225/7814/cocteautwinsaikeaguineaposter1.jpg

[by the sea]

http://img225.exs.cx/img225/7400/cocteautwinsthepinkopaquecd14c.jpg

[by the sea]

http://img225.exs.cx/img225/4875/card513wu.jpg

[by the sea]

http://img225.exs.cx/img225/3813/echoes12b18ku.jpg

[by the sea]

http://img214.exs.cx/img214/4678/victorialpf113rm.jpg
http://img214.exs.cx/img214/3806/victoriaisf118ux.jpg

[by the sea]

http://img214.exs.cx/img214/3226/sleeveloveseasytears13lt.jpg

[by the sea]

http://img214.exs.cx/img214/2949/moonps12th.jpg

[by the sea]

http://img214.exs.cx/img214/2559/mam2lpia112tk.jpg

[Avninder]

V23 Rocks! I wouldn't mind if all the money from the Twins reunion went to the band and this amazing art troop.

[by the sea]

I wouldn't mind if all the money from the Twins reunion went to the band and this amazing art troop.

You might not mind, but I'm positive the band would.

[E-Lo]

Nice pics Sage, but isn't this 23 Envelope's work? I think v23 is without photographer Nigel Grierson.

[by the sea]

I don't know, this is what it says on ct.org ...

v23 or 23 Envelope are a design firm who have worked on many Cocteau Twins album covers.

You could be right, E.

I also wonder if Nigel shot all the photographs I posted. Moon and The Melodies is so beautiful, they all are. This is my absolute favorite though ...

http://img110.exs.cx/img110/9136/card918xt.jpg

[by the sea]

I also wonder if Nigel shot all the photographs I posted?

I mean except for The Spangle Maker which I read is
Gertrude Käsebier

[andylama]

Nice. Reminds me: recently at a local bookstore, I browsed through a little book of Gertrude Kaesebier's photography. Despite her German-sounding name, she was American.

http://www.umass.edu/english/asp/davidov/kasebier_large.jpg

Isn't she marvelous?

http://www.elangelcaido.org/fotos/kasebier.jpg
"Road to Rome", 1903

[kaini]

Isn't she marvelous?



Yes she is, and I think she could inspire some good colonial story to Phil Lawton. :bum:

[toothbrush]

great stuff, sage!
i love the way their pics reject rationality...like they won't let you fully grasp them

[Colin]

. . .This is my absolute favorite though ...

http://img110.exs.cx/img110/9136/card918xt.jpg

I don't recognize this one. What is it from??

[multymfoiled]

That's the cover of "Les Mystere Des Voix Bulgares, vol. 1"..It's one of my faves as well!

[andylama]

LMDVB have made better recordings...but never with better cover art. ;)

[Adam]

Violet Indiana's 'CHOKE' sleeve is designed by v23, too.

[plink]

They CT's first covers were really part of the magic...
I've spent hours looking at every detail ... I was really in love with this artwork.


i spent hours studying the artowrk too. i loved the almost symbiotic nature of the relationship between the aural and the visual.

when i first got victorialand on lp i could barely speak, all those textures, the use of the spot varnish (the shiny areas over the photo) against the crumpled paper. ahh. quite sublime.

i have to admit though that i did play it the first time at 33rpm, not the suggested 45rpm. that made for a very strange lestening experience!! did anyone else do that?

[Chora]

23 Envelope, V23 same difference, I love the work! It's why I went to Design school...as I've said before.......


I appreciated 23 earlier work, during the 90's I kind of gave up. I love their minimalist approach like "Loves'Easy", This Mortal Coil....


P.S. I would loveto see your work Pale Clouded. :)

[plink]

http://www.kingston.ac.uk/picker/cp_images/buckets.jpg

Slightly off the Ground
18 January - 3 March 2007

stanleypickergallery (http://www.stanleypickergallery.org/)

just found out about this. the gallery is part of kingston university in kingston upon thames uk.

i presume it's an accompaniment to the poster design book that came out last year. there also appears to be a live 4ad event at some point to accompany the exhibition, but i can't find detail yet, probably "details tbc".

[seagirrl]

Ooh, thanks! :)

[Simonp]

Slightly off the Ground

18 January - 3 March 2007

For more than 25 years Vaughan Oliver has been creating seductive graphic works combining word and image for some of the world’s most influential contemporary musicians, developing distinctive visual vocabularies to accompany the careers for artists as diverse as Pixies and Cocteau Twins as well as more recent work for the likes of Scott Walker and TV on the Radio. His designs form part of the Victoria & Albert Museum collection and have been exhibited in Paris, Tokyo, Los Angeles and Athens.

Slightly off the Ground presents a personal selection of his iconic music posters from early works with 4AD to the present day, the exhibition providing a rare overview of the themes and influences that underpin the practice of this inspirational graphic alchemist. The specially devised gallery installation, evocative of the street setting where the posters would have been first encountered, is designed together with his long term collaborator Chris Bigg, and will be sound-tracked by the music that inspired the resulting designs.

Oliver says of developing this exhibition:

"When I first started designing posters the streets were alive with cutting edge work designed for the independent music scene. Posters by Peter Saville, Neville Brody, Malcolm Garrett, Martyn Atkins and C More Tone vied for your attention and set a very colourful fabric for the city with their illicit expressions. As that period gave way to a cleaning purge by the City¹s Council and a creeping conservatism in the music industry the vibrant skin was peeled away. A new generation of designers were denied a public canvas. The art of graffiti replaced this ink on paper. In the age of the download the visual aspect of presenting music would seem to be less important than it was. The exhibition reminds us of the special relationship between a carefully considered graphic design and its musical partner. In the same way that a successful package for the music can enhance the listener¹s appreciation of the music then a good poster can be an exciting gateway to the listening experience. When the poster draws your attention, reflects the music and leaves an impression then it¹s doing its job. Pulling on a personal archive of around 200 posters the exhibition is a celebration of this lost art, including street posters for clients in music, theatre and dance, smaller posters for record shops and galleries and commissions for limited editions."

“Vaughan Oliver & v23 Poster Designs” published by v23, available from the gallery during the exhibition.

A limited-edition print poster is available to purchase from the gallery during the exhibition.

Artist Talk 5pm Wednesday 17 January (booking essential)
A special 4AD live event will take place to accompany the exhibition, date and venue to be confirmed.

[Simonp]

Slightly off the Ground

18 January - 3 March 2007

For more than 25 years Vaughan Oliver has been creating seductive graphic works combining word and image for some of the world’s most influential contemporary musicians, developing distinctive visual vocabularies to accompany the careers for artists as diverse as Pixies and Cocteau Twins as well as more recent work for the likes of Scott Walker and TV on the Radio. His designs form part of the Victoria & Albert Museum collection and have been exhibited in Paris, Tokyo, Los Angeles and Athens.

Slightly off the Ground presents a personal selection of his iconic music posters from early works with 4AD to the present day, the exhibition providing a rare overview of the themes and influences that underpin the practice of this inspirational graphic alchemist. The specially devised gallery installation, evocative of the street setting where the posters would have been first encountered, is designed together with his long term collaborator Chris Bigg, and will be sound-tracked by the music that inspired the resulting designs.

Oliver says of developing this exhibition:

"When I first started designing posters the streets were alive with cutting edge work designed for the independent music scene. Posters by Peter Saville, Neville Brody, Malcolm Garrett, Martyn Atkins and C More Tone vied for your attention and set a very colourful fabric for the city with their illicit expressions. As that period gave way to a cleaning purge by the City¹s Council and a creeping conservatism in the music industry the vibrant skin was peeled away. A new generation of designers were denied a public canvas. The art of graffiti replaced this ink on paper. In the age of the download the visual aspect of presenting music would seem to be less important than it was. The exhibition reminds us of the special relationship between a carefully considered graphic design and its musical partner. In the same way that a successful package for the music can enhance the listener¹s appreciation of the music then a good poster can be an exciting gateway to the listening experience. When the poster draws your attention, reflects the music and leaves an impression then it¹s doing its job. Pulling on a personal archive of around 200 posters the exhibition is a celebration of this lost art, including street posters for clients in music, theatre and dance, smaller posters for record shops and galleries and commissions for limited editions."

“Vaughan Oliver & v23 Poster Designs” published by v23, available from the gallery during the exhibition.

A limited-edition print poster is available to purchase from the gallery during the exhibition.

Artist Talk 5pm Wednesday 17 January (booking essential)
A special 4AD live event will take place to accompany the exhibition, date and venue to be confirmed.


http://www.stanleypickergallery.org/

[plink]

during the question and answer session of the artist talk at the start of the exhibition, someone asked mr v whether, after the success of the thames and hudson pictorial history of factory records,

http://ec2.images-amazon.com/images/P/0500513007.01._SS400_SCLZZZZZZZ_.jpg

there may be a similar pictorial retrospective of the musical output of 4ad.

mr v seemed quite taken by the idea. :cheers: :banana: :banana: :banana: :cool:


did anyone else here get along to the preview just out of interest?

[seagirrl]

Yes, I did. But you already know that. :)

[plink]

the place was a bugger to find! though wine at a pound a glass made up for it (glug glug)

[plink]

oooh, i've just been amalgamated!! and i felt nothing! :eek: